ROdown Blog

Nice wrap Ehon :) I was just listening to triple j and heard Tom Ballard who had lined up a few Man Week songs.

One of them was a song talking about a guy's sexual performance, and Tom made the point that the reaction, if such a song was written about a female, would most probably be one of outrage. Why is it that women get away with singing 'funny', but potentially anxiety inducing songs about men, yet the other way around would be completely unacceptable?

Some interesting experiences you have to share Ehon.

I think some of the most interesting discussions that have come out of Man Week have been regarding cultural differences (and in some cases similarities) around perceptions of masculinity.

I wonder Ehon -- if you think that being 'foreign' to Australia, do you have different or similar understanding of masculinity to 'white Australias'?

I particularly like the idea of maculinity in transition, that Ehon suggested. That masculinity has changed, because society has changed. I wonder, if we as individuals, could change the perceptions of what it is to be man, how would we change them?

And gee, Anna! What a thought provoking comment. I think it's interesting to contrast the constructs of feminity and masculinity like that. Consider Lily Alan's "Not Fair" for example:

"well I lie here in the wet patch in the middle of the bed
I'm feeling pretty damn hard done by, I spent ages giving head
then I remember all the nice things that you've ever said to me
maybe I'm just overreacting, maybe your the one for me"

... followed by a chorus of...

"it's not fair and I think your really mean
I think your really mean
yes I think your really mean

oh your supposed to care but you never make me scream
you never make me scream

oh it's not fair and it's really not ok
it's really not ok
it's really not ok"

How are guys meant to interpret these messages?

What if a guy sung a song which included the lyrics:

"when we go up to bed you're just not good it's such a shame"

Why does society treat male sexual gratification differently to female sexual gratification?

Hey Anna - I must agree that there is a generalisation that men can take dissing better than female. I am not sure if I am right but generally, men are *expected* to suck it in.

What do you guys think - are men expected to take shit more than women?

Hey Mathew - great question and I think its pretty difficult to answer to that as well.

I think the Asians still find it difficult to embrace or accept the idea of lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender, especially in the older generation.

However, when it comes to talking about emotions or feelings - especially the young generations - there is a general agreement that men and women alike aren't perfect. For example we talk about our tough times pretty openly - there's not much of the "tough bloke" image going around in the Asian culture, I must say. Having said that, the concept of "men should be the head of the family - they should protect and provide" is still pretty huge in the Asian culture.

What's intrigued me when I first moved to Australia was the whole idea of a "bloke". With all due respect to the Aussie blokes - I didn't understand why must man be tough and not talk about their problems or show their sentimental side.

I think part of the reason why it's more "acceptable" for songs to be written about male's sexual performance is because guys in general seem to be a lot more open about their sexual performance as compared to females. Males seem to discuss those things with their male friends, whereas females are a bit more secretive about it - I think this is partially due to the fact that females get branded "sluts" and "whores" if they sleep around, whereas it seems to be more acceptable for males to sleep with whomever they feel like, whenever they feel like. But then again, I think that partially goes back to the history of mankind, males have always been regarded as the "superior" sex so they were entitled to have many wives, whereas females were not.

Thanks Chels.

I thought women would be more willing to share about their sexual experience(s) especially amongst their "BFFs"?

The main thing I have taken away from Man Week is the realisation that, for most, being a "man" simply means being comfortable with yourself - you dont have to fit into society's rigid stereotype of an alpha male.

Although it is widely believed that females are the "underdogs" and arent treated as equally as males, males definitely get discriminated against too. Society makes it acceptable for girls to talk about their feelings but not about anything sexually related. The opposite is true for males. Where's the sense in that?
This week has been great reading everybodys comments about these issues. :)

I think women are a bit more selective who they talk to about their sex lives (for fear of being branded a slut...), so females only really talk to their best friend. Whereas I think males are more open overall and talk to their whole group of guy friends. 

Man week certainly has been an interesting week; it's something I've been following closely with keen intent.

The thing that I've noticed most about man week is about the different emphasises on men, and the way that the male gender as a whole is seen as; it almost seems that there is a contradiction of sorts as pointed out in Mathew's lyrics example.

In answer to your original question Ehon, I don't think my answer to my opinion on what a man is has changed... but I think that many other people have come to the realisation of what a man is, what they think and how they feel. I don't think as many are as 'tough' or 'butch' as they are claimed to be. Gotta love stigmas.

My friend on Twitter said:

A: Men's sexual performance is rated on a scale of 1to100. Women's sexual performance is rated on a scale of Yes/No.

Stigma is a funny thing...

Tom Ballard also spoke about coming out in year 12 ( a few years back), and how the worst bit had been the lead up - the worry about what people would think.

He said everyone was really cool about it once he came out and it was a really good experience for him - but before he did come out when people didn't know he was gay people would make little comments like 'that's so gay' etc, which kind of added to that worry and feeling different.

He also gave ReachOut.com a nice plug :)

From my humble female perspective, this has been a really fascinating discussion this week and based on the number of comments in the forums, much needed. Hope you've found it helpful :) But continue!! And see you on the forums at 6pm AEST!!

Hey Ehon,

Love the blog! Very honest and insightful!

Anna - I don't know the song, but I know one song recently that I have heard and I actually thought about it, and the way it objectifies men in a sense...but I was also pleased to hear a women being open about sexuality, sexual gratification and those things because often I think it is more acceptable in society for men to objectify women and make jokes and so on.

Ideally though, I would like to see us as a society get past that to a point of freedom in society for both men and women, where who we are as people matters more than that. Still, I don't think such songs are totally uncalled for or anything. Just my thoughts.

As far as sharing about sexual experiences I think it really depends on personality and life experiences more than gender! I know plenty of girls who are quite open about it, and plenty of guys too. But I also know guys and girls who prefer not to go there.

Have also enjoyed the discussions this week :-)

Women tend to talk more one on one with one another than males do, but when it comes to subjects of sex, a male can stand in his group of mates and brag of his conquests, and yet should a female be open minded on sex she is branded a slut where as a male is branded a stud, in saying all the above the other thing that really peaves me off is that its socially acceptable for two women to be bi-sexual or bi-curious but when it comes to the opposite gender, the name calling and bullying starts.  Two completly different types of human beings yet we are from the same planet.  There is no shame in a male crying nor a male talking one on one to a mate, there is no shame in being true to yourself male or female, for noone has the right to judge another. We are all individuals, we are all unique, and we all feel.

i have to agree with libbys comment 110% males do definatly get discriminated against, alot more than is ever spoken of. For example domestic violence is almost always associated with a male being violent towards a female, yet it happens to males just as much (if not more) as it does to females, however an man (due to societys expectations) is less likely to tell anyone of this happening to him for fear of ridicule, embarrasment and or humiliation.  We are brought up to believe that men are strong, men provide, men are the hunters, yet we forget the times have changed, and women have fort for equal rights and opportunities, yet society dosnt recognise that men too feel, hurt, and suffer just the same complex emotions of their female counter parts.